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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 2:03 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:01 am
Posts: 12
Some more examples of how that works.

Lets say a powerful tech nation building great landwalkers and airships wants to grab the nomads’ lands because of multiple coal deposits. They can easily land their walkers and ships at the trade area (low-tech, everything goes cool). As soon as they enter the low-magic desert area desert, walkers and airships start to break abnormally easy (basically, becoming ”fragile”). To proceed, the nation either needs to put more resources and be ready to loose many machines, or to be patient and slowly “sabotage” the area they want by building more tech posts, maybe some roads or underground shelters, in the nomad lands (secretly, with permission of corrupt nomad leaders etc); dealing with nomadic druids and destroying their worship places can help to. When they succeed to shift the area from low-magic to low tech, they can bring on their machines safely - and the nomads might discover their old magic is weakening and not helping them against the machines. However, when the landwalkers reach the Oasis (high-magic area), they are likely to drop junk - because this is the next region and it is too bad for the walkers. Destroying its magic is going to require even greater efforts.

Magic users are going to have the same problems with the tech areas: if they want to “cleanse” a high-tech city with their magic and reawaken the magical creatures that once lived at the place, they need to bring destructions to its factories and key buildings, decrease its populace and slowly bring magic items/perform magic rituals to make the place suit their needs, slowly increasing their power.


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:18 pm 

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 190
so what is the base line for a region, equal science and magic, low magic?

also as a thought, does the level of magic / science depend on the region's make up in some way. sort of. shinto view where the magic is tied to a natural wonder, or the science might be tied to a large iron deposit.


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:16 am 

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:01 am
Posts: 12
I initially used the system with no neutral regions, no "baseline" - "low tech" and "low magic" region traits border each other. If we really need it, we can introduce compeltely neutral ones, with the "middle" condtitions.

Region's make up always have things to do with its tech/magic features, and its the make up that any terraformers eventually need to "sabotage" or "improve" . Typically it is not a single regional feature (would be too easy to change the make up then) - its is a number of related ones, with some central one to make an adventure hotspot. Shinto view is the great way to describe it. Only note that no kind of "natural" conditions can make a region go tech-wards: you absolutely need to add artificial key features to make it more tech, that's the point of technology.
This basically means that the world has historically started as way more magical than now, with technology developing only in the most populated regions that have eventually changed their base mag-tech parameters.


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 12:00 pm 

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 190
So with this setting you could play the basic classes from pathfinder as well as any steam punk ones we come up with.


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 12:59 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:01 am
Posts: 12
Yes, it has place for most of them.


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2016 11:16 am 

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 190
Sorry been lost in work. Lets talk about classes...


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2016 10:41 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:01 am
Posts: 12
Speaking briefly on classes.
I believe a PF-based system needs no new classes - what it needs is a bunch of archetypes for old classes, suitable for a tech world rather than a pure fantasy one. A fighter with armor proficiencies replaced with gunnery features makes a great gunner; a rogue with some changes makes a perfect tech specialist; a number of classes might fit for specced pilot places. However, we cannot really create these archetypes without having following mechanics roughly designed:
Rules on piloting (probably a single skill for everything from walkers to air vehicles)
Rules on constructing, customizing and repairing tech devices (probably, expanded rules: geek players seem to love them)
Rules on medicine (without easy-to-get cures we need lots of functions for drugs and, probably, resting options)
Rules on using tech weapons, including weapons larger than personal
List of non-existing skills and feats (for instance, I don't think a steam punk world really has Use Magic Device skill available).

Without all these mechanics roughly outlined, I believe we cannot really talk about any classes or archetypes. All such rules are “physics” of the game world.


P.S. Some of the old classes can probably be used without many changes - such as alchemists or gunslingers - that fit any such world without much tinkering.


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2016 11:16 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:01 am
Posts: 12
... Simply put, fantasy world skills/feats/class abilities focus on using character's inner powers, resources and talents. Tech-world skills/feats/abilities focus on using items with partiular mechanics: that's the basic difference between magic and technology. Characters are going to be using, abusing, constructing, repairing, and upgrading stuff, and we need lots of stuff.


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 Post subject: Re: Lets have some fun
PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 11:38 am 

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:01 am
Posts: 12
And now suggesting something more specific:
1) We can make three new lists for Tech Simple Weapons, Tech Martial Weapons and Tech Exotic weapons for the system. Tech-archetyped classes get proficiencies in them instead of the standard lists.
2) We can make a replacement for the standard armor-and-magics-for-AC system - no full plates or rings of protection for steam punk. I suggest using d20StarWars-type solution: tech heroic classes get special “deflection” AC bonuses that increase with levels, that’s part of their class feature progression.
3) We can scratch spellcasting and living companion options for tech characters. Companions could probably be replaced with special vehicle-related features or pet robots (the latter should not work well in low-tech areas though). Some options for non-spellcaster archetypes already exist in the system (such as skirmisher ranger archetype), we can add more, but basically they should be some tricks/action options.
4) We can scratch skills like Use Magic Device, Spellcraft, Knowledge (arcana, religion) for tech archetypes and replace them with the new skills of Piloting, plus technological crafts and knowledges.

P.S. Outside the class system, I would also suggest some simple reputation mechanics, related to characters’ fame/infamy. Steampunk world typically has implies more social interactions than fantasy wilderness, and reputation is one of the key parameters in urbanized settings.


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